just saying CCP, if i had WANTED to use missiles, i woudl have trained up caldari, if i wanted drones, i would have trained up gallente, i trained amarr because i like lasers. i gues this fits into your whole "make crosstraining easier" thing though, but honestly its mroe like "why bother crosstraining when every race has comparable ships for every battlefield role"

The mighty Armageddon class is the main warship of the Amarr Empire. Its heavy armaments and strong front are specially designed to crash into any battle like a juggernaut and deliver swift justice in the name of the Emperor.

That's only because it's misused and, frankly, lack any role.
Make it a drone boat, and all cap issues will be taken over by overtanking it to death.

They can save up for a navy geddon, they're cheap

So now the faction with the strongest (lore-wise) armor tank has lost the only 8 low bs in the game, I guess its because this thread doesn-¦t had enough ragequit, insults and all that stuff compared with gallente-¦s one.

It's that the way this it's gonna work from now?

Then you are stupid.

@ CCP Rise

Ok, I've been giving a lot of thought lately to the issues quite a few people have expressed about lower skilled / newer players not having a good BS for them to get into without some rather intensive training... as well as my general agreement with I rather don't like that the Amarr do not currently have a T1 8 L slot BS.

So, I would like to suggest this idea, instead. On the Abaddon, remove 2 high slots (yes, remove 2 turrets, and do not give it any utility slots), raise it's damage bonus from 5% to 10% per level, and slap on that 8th low slot. This would allow it to keep the same base DPS, yet give it a means of reducing cap draw that would fit changes done to previous hulls, and allow it an extra slot to work with when fitting tank to help it stay the tankiest of armor ships yet not be something so noticeably powerful in PvP as the old resist boost.

Amarr?

Initial post is the worst of all proposed changes

25 Pages of complaints (mostly)

CCP Rise posts that he is reading them, but isn't changing anything.

He REDUCES the REDUCTION of the Apocs cap to 'solve' our complaint of the Apoc's cap

45 pages....still nothing substantial, especially concerning the Geddon.

I'm just going to keep posting until we get actual revisions.

LOL , stop complaining awesome changes. I wasn't playing much as of late, i was very busy but i found some time to check what is new. Well ...... all i can say is stfu. New Augoror Navy issue- no cap usage bonus. CCP +100000000000 points. New Omen Navy Issue - no cap bonus , CCP +45646456456456456456 points. Harbinger Navy Issue - no cap bonus ... This is awesome. Rebalanced Battleships - no cap bonuses. I couldn't believe in this all awesomness. But i do now.

I know Amarr ships are cap hungry and this will make problems even bigger BUT ... but finnaly we don't have bonus that was FORCED onto us. FOR THE VERY FIRST TIME WE CAN DECIDE ... yes we can decide IF AND HOW we can deal with this problem. Some people may want to rig for less cap usage, some may fit cap booster etc. AND SOME MAY ignore it as it is. Yes exactly that's what you hear is absolutely true. Because you know some people did fly Abaddon even tho it got no cap bonuses, some people did fly Slicer- tho it got no cap bonuses. "Fly" - ok i'm liar - those ships were extremly popular. BECAUSE THEY ACTUALLY HAD BONUSES.

With all honesty i can say that Amarr is finally getting good treatment. Keep it up CCP.

Hi guys

So I've been catching up on the thread a little this morning. I think you all deserve some comment at least, so here you go!

For those of you still concerned about the cap issues that Amarr will now face with both of its turret based options: we hear you. We are really caught here because a significant number of players find the cap bonus less exciting than a bonus like tracking. That said, its a really important bonus because of what it allows laser ships to do. We've been talking with the CSM, watching this thread, and doing experimenting of our own with the new ships internally to try and figure out how much of a problem it is. So far, we remain convinced that you will enjoy the Apoc more, on average, without the cap bonus. We want to let it go to public testing this way and then adjust off feedback at that point if there's major problems.

For those of you concerned about the idea that Gallente got revisions because they asked, and Amarr are not, I urge you to see the two as in completely different situations. The first set of Gallente ships were not just controversial or "off race", they were a broad disappointment. Once people began to point out that they simply fell short, we looked at them and tended to agree, so we were happy to go back and work on them some more. Amarr is in a different place where its not that they are simple "bad" ships, more that there is a lot of disagreement about how this race line should be structured. Thats understandable. We are in a really difficult position of wanting to offer new options for Amarr pilots, despite them having 2 iconic ships and one fleet staple. That means no matter where we go (for instance if the Apoc had become the drone ship) someone is going to be unhappy.

We, along with many players, feel that this an exciting direction for Amarr. I would ask that you guys accept this draft as more or less set, and then help us out with testing once these go to a public server.

I do appreciate your feedback and promise that its not falling on deaf ears.

Being called Gallentean right after Gallente were saying we hate Gallente is pretty awesome.

You're right about the primary racial roles, but Amarr has been establishing a stronger drone representation throughout tiericide. Dragoon -> Arbitrator -> Prophecy. And Khanid has always existed as a missile focused division of Amarr. I don't think we are straying far at all from Amarr offensive system organization with this battleship line.

Yeah I mean I would love if we could have new art for every rebalance so that "legacy" ships like the Armageddon could stay the way they always have been. Its easy to see why this would be impossible though, right? Resource drain on art teams here would be immense, but more importantly, the game would quickly become an impossible maze of ships. If we want to be serious about refining the quality of balance in Eve, we would quickly have tens of ships in each class as we iterated through them.

Fun for some I'm sure, but probably not good for the game overall =P

Oh I'll be coming near them pretty soon alright =)

I think you'll be happy though.

@ CCP Rise

Ok, I've been giving a lot of thought lately to the issues quite a few people have expressed about lower skilled / newer players not having a good BS for them to get into without some rather intensive training... as well as my general agreement with I rather don't like that the Amarr do not currently have a T1 8 L slot BS.

So, I would like to suggest this idea, instead. On the Abaddon, remove 2 high slots (yes, remove 2 turrets, and do not give it any utility slots), raise it's damage bonus from 5% to 10% per level, and slap on that 8th low slot. This would allow it to keep the same base DPS, yet give it a means of reducing cap draw that would fit changes done to previous hulls, and allow it an extra slot to work with when fitting tank to help it stay the tankiest of armor ships yet not be something so noticeably powerful in PvP as the old resist boost.